Choosing the right plastic for a custom robot chassis

This discussion started in another thread, but I think it’s interesting enough to warrant its own thread, so I’m kicking it off here…

The question is, what plastic sheet stocks are best for robot chassis applications? I have noticed that this community is decidedly pro-lexan, but there are many, many other options out there, so let’s talk about them. To keep cost comparisons apples-to-apples, let’s assume 1/8" x 12" x 12" sheets.

When looking at the different plastics out there, keep a few things in mind. First, some plastics are better at some things than others, meaning many of them are engineered to be good for a specific purpose or purposes. Often when a plastic is really good at one thing, it compromises somewhere else. Of course some are general purpose and work well in a lot of applications. Cost is also a factor - hobby roboteers are not going to spend $300 on a small sheet of PEEK, but any of the plastics in the $5 - $20 a sheet range are in play.

So let’s talk specifics. Below are the plastics I have direct experience trying to build with and my opinion on them.

MDS-Filled Nylon 6/6: This is a nice looking dark gray plastic with a metallic shimmer to it. On paper it has good properties for the price (about $11). It’s very hard and strong.

Unfortunately, it is prone to warping. My sheet was warped, and when I complained, I got a slightly less warped sheet. They said it’s all warped. Maybe it could be straightened, but I wouldn’t trust it to stay that way. Tis a shame because it’s otherwise a great material. I’m going to stay away from nylon-based sheets from now on; however, I have had good experience with molded nylon small parts and will continue to use them (like the Lynxmotion hex standoffs).

Polycarbonate (Lexan): This is the plastic used in the Lynxmotion kits, and it’s used for RC car bodies (because it’s strong, and comes in clear, so that painting the underside gives a durable shiny finish). It’s quite stiff, is straight and true as an arrow, and is cheap ($6). It’s shiny and scratches easily, so you have to random-orbit sand it to get a more durable satin finish.

My personal opinion is that lexan is somewhat over-hyped due to its use as “bulletproof” glass, which means it has a very great point-impact strength for a clear plastic. Remember, when it’s great at one thing, there is usually a weakness, and lexan is not without limitations. It’s well known that lexan is damaged by common chemicals used in hobby projects, including thread lock and super glue. This is a problem for me since I’m addicted to Loctite. Also, lexan is prone to cracking and chipping under stress (power tools), but that can be true of any hard plastic if you are not careful. Despite these criticisms, the combination of strength, rigidity, stability and light weight make lexan a great choice for a robot chassis.

Acrylic (Plexiglass): This material is used in a lot of the same ways as lexan, and it has similar properties. It’s straight, stiff and strong. It’s inexpensive. It is more brittle than lexan, and also stratches easily. Acrylic could be a good option for someone wanting the good properties of lexan without the chemical interactions.

PVC Type 1 (vinyl): This a low cost plastic that’s merely ok. It’s dense and it feels heavy. This stuff is everywhere, so most people have probably used it for one thing or another at one point. But my feeling is that if you can afford a $4 sheet of plastic, you can afford a $6 or $10 sheet of plastic that will be lighter and stronger. I can’t see any reason to use this over some other commonly available options unless you have it lying around.

PVC foamboard (Sintra): This is a very light weight and stiff but weak plastic, which melts if you look at it the wrong way. It’s not at all suitable for a robot chassis in my opinion unless the robot is tiny and weight is extremely important, but even then I would just go with a thinner stock of a more durable plastic.

Acetal resin (Delrin): This is a strong and stiff plastic, but it’s noticably heavier than the others (except PVC Type 1). No warping, and it holds its shape. It cuts and drills really smooth, probably due to its density. I think this is a great choice for a larger bot chassis that mixes metal and plastic. This is what I’ll use for my tracked vehicle chassis. Cost is a bit more than lexan ($9).

ABS: This is a light weight plastic that’s relatively strong. It’s flexy and warps a bit. Cost is about $2 more than lexan. It’s a decent choice for small lightweight bots. I may end up using this for a mini-sumo bot.

Polyethylene UHMW: From EddieB, who used some surplus in his ROV project: “I wouldn’t recommend it really as it is somewhat soft and really hard on tools. On the positive side it’s easy to self-tap threads and it doesn’t tend to chip when you’re cuting/drilling it either.” Looking at the specs on it, it’s not very strong and costs more than 3 times as much as lexan in small quantities. Methinks it’s not designed for this application.

I wanted to also include this good advice from spacejunk on working with plastic: “Try a plastic drill bit for drilling plastic. They have a negative rake angle and scrape rather than cut. Also drill at a slower speed and make sure the bit doesn’t melt the sheet.”

Please feel free to share your wisdom and experiences with any of the above or talk about other plastics you have used or plan to use.

Well I have to disagree on a few of them.

For one, Lexan isn’t bulletproof. In fact, it’s barely bullet resistant. Bullet proof glass used in banks and such is usually over an inch thick. And it’s made up of multiple thin layers of Lexan and shatter-proof glass or plexiglass. Lexan could be bullet resistant but not at anything under 2 inches thick alone. It has excellent properties and resists bending and shattering. A very durable material. Kind of like working with Plexiglass (acrylic) only without having to worry about shattering or chipping.
I hate that is is so hard to find it solid black in large sheets.

ABS is alright but not a very good structural component in anything under 1/2". For small parts, it would be ok. But it just has too much flex to be useful as a large plate or chassis component.

Acetal sheets are incredible. Delrin is very strong, extremely durable and easy to machine. Just very expensive in decent thicknesses.

Both locally and from my online suppliers, UHMW or hockey board, is half the price of Lexan in a 4X8 foot sheet. Especially in 1/2 and over thicknesses. It is much more rigid than ABS of the same thickness but not quite as rigid as Lexan. It is very easy to machine and cut.
The only downfalls I found in large and small pieces is that it is less rigid than lexan or aluminum, and is hard to find in colors other than white and black. Although black is good.

Using true bulletproof layered lexan sheets would be the absolute best. Very pricey though.

I have to disagree about acrylic. It can be very durable and is used for things like optics. Like a waterproof camera window. It is also bent very easily.

I appreciate the effort.

nick_a

I did read some articles about Lexan when I saw RobotDudes chassis’s…

Evidently it tends to melt when power drilling and it recommends not using power tools at all. Hand drills and hacksaws. Supposedly though it can be used quite well in forming applications.

Access to most of these plastics in the U.K. is quite limited though.

You mentioned glues and especially Loctite. Does Loctite work effectively on ABS as I’ve never found a glue that will work well with it. Kids broken toys tend to stay broken if they are ABS.

Loctite isn’t a glue, it is thread lock. Sorry for the confusion, you might not have that brand in the UK. You use it for metal-on-metal screws. It just keeps the screws from coming loose over time from vibration or other forces. It works really well, and it’s not hard to remove a locked screw with a screwdriver.

I actually have had good results melting broken styrene. Melt it just enough to get the crack to come together.

Edit: PaulP, I didn’t even realize Loctite made a lot of different adhesives. I was only familiar with the Blue since it’s all I use.

We do have Loctite threadlock over here, they are also the biggest supplier (the only one I buy) of SuperGlue (cyano-acrylate is it?)

Yup, everyone just calls it CA. It doesn’t play nice with lexan, but I only use it for one thing - to glue tires to wheels.

Supposedly it also good for open wounds as well, not that I’d try it.

One of my lads cut his head open a few weeks ago and they used CA to glue him up rather than stitches, must admit he’s been left with less of a scar than he might have had…

I don’t know if its true or not but the doc mentioned that it may have been originally developed for the military for exactly that purpose…

Must admit it always sticks my fingers better than whatever I’m trying to repair.

Sorry for the Hi-jack, back to plastics…

If a certain person doesn’t put a certain design on the market, then I’m looking in the future to do a hexapod from scratch.

I’ve managed to find some Lexan on ebay but its not a regular supplier, just some offcuts but it does sound as if there may be better, cheaper options…

I have drilled and cut Lexan with power drills, band saws, and table saws on many occasions. It works fine. :open_mouth: Yes, you need to slow down the speed a bit, but there’s no trouble. No I have gotten it to melt with a reciprocating saw once. But it’s not the tool of choice for robot builders anyway.

I may have perpetuated a myth that Loctite can craze polycarbonate. I received an email ages ago from a customer saying it had happened, so we added the info to the assembly guides that use polycarbonate. I have just tested Loctite Blue 242 on polycarbonate and well, there is absolutely NO reaction… :unamused:

I have used CA on my cuts lots of times. Its important that the cut is closed tight and that you do not apply the glue directly on the cut, but rather, next to it, and then smear it over the cut to prevent it form getting inside. Works well :laughing: it holds long enough usually for the cut to begin to heal shut, depending on the cleanness of the cut.

I have tried that experiment as well, I don’t think you’ll see a noticable reaction… it’s not like the lexan is going to disintegrate or something. The problem is, over time, the area of lexan around the locked screw hole will become brittle and crack, and the area around the hole is already prone to cracking…

But people should do their own experiments and make up their own mind. One of the most enjoyable things about this hobby is the discovery process. In the end, it’s just a cheap piece of plastic, so it’s easy enough to cut and drill another one.

Edit: I don’t want to sound like I’m bashing lexan if anyone has gotten that impression. It’s a great material, obviously. Even iPods are made from it. The Lynxmotion lexan kits are really nice. I own one. I do wish there were more material options, but it wouldn’t stop me from buying one. Loctite is entirely optional.

yes, im going to have to go with lexan or something, and again, i haven’t had too much experience with many other, but it seems like a good choice

like evolution said lexan in the thickness that us roboteers are far from bulletproof, anything at 3-5 mm thick whould not stop a bullet, save maybe an incredibly malliable (i think thats it) metal that would stretch to absord the imbact, or kevlar

Putting Kevlar material inside the chassis would deffinately be a plus! I’ll have ot try that someday, its soo tempting :laughing:

Now, Lexan is a great plastic for robot building. I have made two chassis with it using some L brackets and screws and it is a very good source for this type of application. IMO though, Lexan and Aluminum together is the best chassis to create (with kevlar material on the inside :laughing: ).

What is evolution using for his 3 tracked rovers?

i think Aluminum,
but hats just my 0.02 :wink:

Not aluminum.
It’s a hybrid plastic I designed and had my Plastic manufacturer make up. It took him some time to get the combination right but the end result is amazing.

It’s a polyethylene/ABS hybrid. Basically many thin sheets of polyethylene bonded between many thin sheets of High Density ABS. It is as rigid as Lexan but doesn’t shatter, even when shot, and can’t be broken by hand. It’s nearly indestructible.

The 1" hybrid plastic is used on MARV and MART, the combat versions, and they have Kevlar Weave fused into the ABS in between layers. They are actually bullet proof. Can take six .357 rounds, center mass, at 70 feet before they start to exit out the other side. .22 rounds just stick into it like pellets. The bullet-proof material is about 4 times more expensive than the other material. And the other material is about twice as expensive as Lexan. But the price will improve now that we have the process down. It is as rigid as lexan at 1/2" and over thicknesses. The more layers we can use, the more rigid. But it is equally as durable at any thickness.
I can stand on a 1/2" thick sheet that’s 2 feet by 4 feet with the ends up on chairs, and it barely sags.

I don’t thick it would be as useful in 1/8" or 3/16" sizes since it becomes less rigid than lexan. You need the extra room in a thicker sheet to fuse more layers together.

That sounds like some high tech stuff. You’re not fooling around…

wow :open_mouth:

i wish i had ur job/hobby :slight_smile:

i wanna go to college for some something that i can builkd chassis and stuff, like u do right now pretty much

My advice, if you want to work in this hobby, is to major in Electrical Engineering. It’s the most difficult of the robotics disciplines to just pick up in your spare time.