Survey about Exoskeletons

Hi everyone,

I would like to become more active in the field of exoskeletons - probably building an exoskeleton. The questions are somehow always the same with every such project: Why? How come? What for? Pourquoi?
You could help me, building “the right” exoskeleton. I just would like to find out, what makes sense most. At least I would like to avoid, just building an exoskeleton only for myself. Probably it could be useful for some other people as well.

That’s why I’ve created a short survey (<7min) to shed some light on it. I would be very happy if you could take part in it and give me feedback:
https://yujp90be53w.typeform.com/to/mOvytIhT

I am very grateful for your feedback!
Of course, if you are interested I could present the results here.

Best regards
Enrico

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Hi @EnBw and welcome to our forum.

I’ve completed your survey :slight_smile:

Thank you very much for both! :slightly_smiling_face:

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You are welcome.

If the survey is finished, you could present your results here :slight_smile:

Hi Igor,
sure thing. I will post the results here - probably in about a week or so.
Best

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Great. Looking forward to it :slight_smile:

Hi all,

as promised, here are the results of the survey. First of all: thanks to everyone, who participated in it. It was very helpful for me.
These are the direct answers to the questions. So no interpretation or correlation included here.
Let’s start with the Demographics:

  • in total, there were 25 participants in the survey
  • the average age was 42
  • 84% declared to live in europe, the others did not mention their current location

How likely is it that the participant or a friend/relative of the participant would use exoskeletons?

Which limb/joint would be of most interest to be supported?
3_full_vs_single_joints

  • 8% of participants would like to have a full body exoskeleton
  • Besides, 12% would like to have a full set of legs
  • 8% are interested in full hands (wrist & fingers)
  • 72% are interested in (multiple) single joint solutions
  • 0% wanted full arm exoskeletons

4_which_joint

  • Exoskeletons for the knee most favorable (64%)
  • Hip and Foot ankle close by
  • Hand and back equal
  • Arm (Fingers, Elbow, Shoulder) on wish list of ≈20% of participants

For which activities would exoskeleton be used?
5_Purpose_of_exoskeleton

  • Just for fun/Cosplay/Accessory not of interest
  • As Sports device not very interesting
  • Most probably used, when advantage for work & health is expected

  • Motor assistance most important for exoskeletons – full replacement of muscle activity demanded
  • Muscle activity sensing important
  • Design important, but no need for “cool LEDs”
  • Controllability almost equal: RC, App, Interface to other processors or microcontrollers

Tradeoffs: Speed vs. Strength, Weight vs. Power, Energy vs. Weight

  • Mostly rated with “3”
    The questions seem too technical to me. Most people don’t know how much force/how much speed/how lightweight/…
    It might depend on specific use case & kind of exoskeleton as well as on specific numbers (e.g. 15mins/2hrs/8hrs of operation vs. specific weight)

Willingness to pay for quality and durability

  • People prefer adequate, well built devices for sports, as a working aid or as a limb support, or
  • to some amount cheap exoskeletons just for fun
  • 23% would not spend money for exoskeletons

Additional Comments
These were the comments, that the participants left

I hope, that it is as informative for you as it was for me. If you have questions regarding these, just let me know.

Best regards,
Enrico

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Hi again,

I used the raw data to also correlate some of the answers.
What I also found out: with the “hand” exoskeleton, I was not very precise. What I actually meant is a wrist exoskeleton. That’s why the fingers and thumb are listed as a seperate exoskeleton. I hope, that all participants saw it the same way - but I cannot guarantee for that.

Lets start:
Age vs. Likeliness to wear exoskeletons
How is the likeliness to wear exoskeletons depending on the age of the participant?

  • no participants were younger than 20, so I skipped this line.
  • the bottom diagram is the sum of both upper diagrams (so the total sum-up of all entries is 200% in that matrix)
  • The higher the age, the more likely it is, that the person is willing to wear exoskeletons (or knows s.o. who might do so)
  • older than 30yrs → more willing to wear exoskeletons

Limb/Joint of most interest vs. its application
This matrix correlates the interest in a certain joint with the purpose that the participant prefers. E.g. if someone is only interested in “back exoskeletons” and prefers to wear it “Just for fun” (high rating) it would increase the score in that field in the table.

  • body weaknesses: legs, especially knees seem to be the most favorable joints
  • Working aid: all joints equal
  • Shoulder, elbow, back not wanted for fun/Cosplay/Accessory
  • Ankle, knee & shoulder might also be used just for fun or sports
  • Fingers & hand interesting for fun and cosplay as well

Limb/Joint of most interest vs. required features
Question: can a certain feature be assigned to a certain type of exoskeleton or joint? E.g. do hand exoskeletons need LEDs and knee exoskeletons preferable strong motors? This diagram shows some trends about this:

  • Motor assistance for all joints important, but if highest interest for the legs and elbows
  • Sensing of muscle activity most interesting for legs and elbow
  • Design for leg exoskeleton seem important (but cool LEDs are not necessary)

Tradeoffs in relation to the joints
Do some trends regarding high strength/high speed, lightweight/high power or large/small battery correlate more or less with some joints?

So that’s it actually.
As I said: hopefully it is helpful for you and don’t hesitate to discuss about it or ask me some further questions.
For me it was interesting to go through the process, because it is the first survey that I ever set up. :grinning:

Best regards,
Enrico

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Hi @EnBw ,

Thank you for sharing these details with us. It is very interesting to see how people are thinking.

There were not so many participants, but still, I think results are helpful.

What will you do now with these results?

For example, will you plan now to build low-cost exoskeleton for knee joint, since according to results this one is most favorable :slight_smile:

Hi Igor_X,

I am thinking of building an exoskeleton for the legs. But it is not yet clear to me, if it should be full legs or if I should start with single joints. Also I am not sure how to actuate it. Maybe I should try to find out first, how good it works, to control a motor via an EMG sensor.
But I think it might take some time, to get a clearer picture on that. Also the control of a full set of legs is quite challenging - at least, when the person wearing it should not loose the balance and fall.
Question after question to be answered… :astonished: :slightly_smiling_face:

Best regards,
Enrico

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This looks like a some kind of exoskeleton:

Maybe you would have some recommendations for this user?

I am new to this forum. I would like to know have you made your robot already ?

Hi,

I have not made one yet.
I am currently thinking about making an exoskeleton for the knee, the hip or the ankle.
I actually don’t like the idea to attach the exoskeleton from the side, as it is done for most full leg exoskeletons. I think it would be nice, to have it attached above/in front of the leg.I am not yet sure how I would actuate it. Maybe motor + spindle would be a good idea. (?)
I am currently thinking of a rough design of the exoskeleton. And I am also trying to find out, what forces/torques the motors need.

Enrico

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I am intrested in the project as well , if possible we can work on this together.

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I didn’t see any indication that you have formal training in orthotics. If not, keep in mind that you are attaching your device to a human being, and it will likely be powerful enough to injure the person if something goes wrong. Motor controllers can fail in a way that the motor turns on unexpectedly, and of course, a programming error will likely resut in the same thing at some point in its development. So, you have to be pretty good at both biomedical engineering, and in designing ultra-reliable robotics. You’ve seen a need, and you are now hunting for a way to address that need, but you have chosen a very difficult project.

If you want to proceed, I suggest you abandon any idea of strapping anything onto anyone for now. Instead, focus on things that people sit on, or perhaps grab. E.g. there are chairs that will lift up the seat cushion to help a person get out of the chair. Of course, that is a problem that is already solved. But, perhaps you can find another.

I will mention a particular need I see, that is not yet met in the market. Personally, I have a muscle disorder and am easily fatigued. This is only a problem when I go to shopping malls, or to a county fair. I am not an invalid, so I don’t need medical grade equipment to get around. If an scooter occasionally gets stuck when it is used on the grass, I can deal with that. There are some relatively low cost mobility scooters out there, which are both very light (under 40 pounds), and low cost (around $400-$700). But, those cannot go over grass because the single drive wheel just spins in the grass. [ VEVOR Portable 3-Wheel Mobility Scooter for Seniors 12 Mile Range Max 330LBS | eBay or Robot or human? ]. There are other ones out there, that are both light-weight and can be used in grass, but those cost dramatically more. Engineering is not just about calculating forces, but also economics.

The ones with a single front power wheel, cannot go up hill, because all your weight transfers to the unpowered rear wheels. The one with rear-wheel power, really needs both wheels to be powered. Also, you really need larger wheels, such as ones made for hoverboards, that can go over grass. In fact, hoverboards have turned powerful BLDC motors into commodity items.

My bottom line recommendation is to start with something simpler, to help build your robotics skills. And choose something that doesn’t present a danger to its user until you gain the knowledge and experience to properly design a biomedical device.

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@fb1: I hope you have seen my pm?
@cadcoke5: Thanks for your suggestions. I can imagine, that it is very frustrating, to have only not-so-well-engineered devices available. Of course it would be a nice topic to redesign/optimize such a scooter.

I would prefer not to focus on low hanging fruits. For me arranging some wheels with motors and make them turn on command seem like a moderate challenge. But I guess, there are many people out there, who are quite capable of achieving such a functionality. Hereby, I would encourage everyone who is reading this to think of such a solution. Probably it is not only @cadcoke5 who would benefit from it.
Personnally, I would prefer something more challenging. I am not a biomedical engineer, but I think, engineering in this direction, learning about regulations and following them, might end up in a safe exoskeleton, that could one day be worn be someone. As you said, probably it is about engineering, and engineering a safe device that would not harm someone. Probably the biggest challenge in it lies in a good risk as well as failure mode and effects analysis - and of course the reduction of all the potential risks and failure modes. So I just try it this way. Of course the device would not be attached to any body (also not mine), if the device is not working properly.

But I thank you for your suggestions and look forward to many others.

Best regards
Enrico

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Since your goal is to create a relatively novel approach to an exoskeleton, consider trying to design it so that any failure in controlling the motors are just not going to cause harm due to the nature of the design.

I gave the seat-lift idea as an example. Such devices use worm-drive actuators, so if a motor turns off, the user is not suddenly dropped down. And the motor system is designed so that its maximum speed cannot throw the user off the chair. Nor is the device even strapped to the person. Though, theoretically, the designer of such a system might have designed a lift that was strapped to the user’s legs instead being inside the chair. There are also crane-type of lifts. Which help get people out of bed, as well as out of a chair. But, they are not as easy to use, and generally a person can’t use it by themselves. There can be multiple ways to solve a problem, with some being safer or easier to use.

For your exoskeleton, I am not clear about your end-use goals. If it can be more narrowly defined, perhaps like the chair lift, it can lead to a more limited usage, but an easier and safer one. (i.e. the in-chair mechanism, vs. the crane type lift) For your exoskeleton, if the goal is to help users lift boxes and put them onto shelves, then the device may not need to strap to the user, It could be a somewhat independent robot, designed so that user grabs some handles on it, and directs the robot in its actions by moving those handles.

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yes i have replied you @EnBw

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