Anyone here play with these? I have a Bioloid Comp kit that I configured into a humanoid. The development is going pretty slow because the included suite of software is GUI-based so I don’t exactly have any control over it.
Anyone interface these to the Bot Board instead of the CM5?
The AX-12 bus defaults to 1Mbps TTL. Can the Bot Board handle 1M bps?
You could pick up a USB2Dynamixel, a FTDI chip (or board), John Hyland’s AX-12 bus device, or the Parallax Propeller. There are several open source solution for these devices. Do a quick Google search. I would post some links but I believe that’s against the rules on this forum.
Hey tom,
I was thinking of getting a bioloid and i was wondering how your doing with yours. Im either going to get a bioloid or make my own humanoid from lynx parts. Have any comments?
I’m doing pretty good with my Bioloid… But you get what you pay for.
The Bioloid is pretty rock solid, but in terms of servo upgrades, you don’t have any choice. The Bioloid uses AX-12+ servos, which has a good 17.1kg-cm (237.2967 oz-in for us in the states), but compared to a HSR5990TGs (which has 333oz-in/417oz-in).
It is a great kit however. Some of my favorite about the Bioloid is that the AX-12+ can sense loads (so you can integrate it into your program as a fail-safe), it can sense temperature, and you can attach two servos in a long C-bracket (such as the ones used in the ankle and the thighs of the Bioloid Humanoid), so that you can have 2DOFs in the same height. The Bioloid also comes with the AX-S1 sensor module, which is quite handy. The kit comes with many “canned” moves, so setting up to get it to run is quite quick after the mechanical build…
On the other hand, if you go the Lynxmotion route, you can upgrade your servos as you go along (although for a biped, you wouldn’t want to upgrade your servo since you would want the strongest ones available up front). The other advantage is the brackets from LM is top-knotch. It’s aluminum, and if you notice, all of the top contenders in robo-one uses aluminum-based frames. Also, you can use the SSC-32 and Atom Bot Board to control your LM-based robots. This route is much more open, and ultimately gives you more control, but at the same time, with more control, comes more work to get your bot up and running. You can however create very powerful programs since it’s so open-ended.
It’s really hard to say whether YOU should get a Bioloid kit or not, since I would’ve enjoyed either route. There’s pros and cons for both. To summarize:
Bioloid Kit:
Pros:
You get TONS of brackets. There are bunch left over, so fear of breaking them are mitigated by the fact that you’ll have spares.
Big bang for your money. 18, 237 oz-in servos that have load sensing and temperature sensing. Plus the software suite, batteries, complete kit!
“Canned” moves and GUI-based motion editor (which can be regarded as a CON depending on your level of development). You can position your robot’s joints by hand then “record” them into motions.
Cons:
Plastic. They are pretty strong plastics but aluminum is probably the king for strength and weight for hobby robotics.
Support. It’s a communal-type of support. Robotis (Bioloid’s manufacturer) has a forum but you’d have to be more patient with the answers, probably due to language barrier and translation. You can get community type of support however.
Programming. You can do the programming in “C” environment if you want to get away from their GUI-based coding, but you’re pretty much on your own. I’ve been a C programmer for almost 17 years, but to get to program the CM-5 in C has still alluded me (I’m probably not spending enough time with it as well, I average 45 minutes of dev time with my robots 
)
LM Route:
Pros:
High-quality parts. Jim doesn’t skimp on materials or the quality of the cut (laser cutting and drilling, you can’t get better then this). The aluminums has an anodized finish, and the plastics are lexan (can you say bullet-proofing material? 
)
Awesome Manufacturer (Jim) and Community Support. Your answers are usually answered in a matter of minutes throughout business hours. I’m still perplexed on how Jim gets anything done with his dedication to forum support.
You use standard servos. LM is one of the distributors for Hitec, but they do not manufacturer it. As such, your can use your LM brackets with pretty much any standard servos. Don’t like Hitec (I don’t know why you wouldn’t, they have the best servos for the $$$ IMO)? Well, you can go with other servo brands.
Awesome software. From Lynxterm to Powerpod, LM’s software suite are pretty solid. I’ve looked through the Sequencer program manual, and it packs a lot of punch for not that high of a price. Remember, the Powerpod generates IK-based software for the hexapods. Can’t get any better then that for free software.
Cons:
Can’t think of any, other then the shipping (LM is in IL where I am in California), can’t blame LM for that, it’s more of a UPS-cost issue
Addictiveness of it all. The possibilities are endless with the SES. I keep playing with POSSIBLE configurations with the SES set then the robot I have built! I think I’ve seen this in someone’s signature and I fully agree with it, Robotics is a drug and LM is the needle.
You can’t go wrong with either. I love my Bioloid and my CH3-R that I’m currently developing. I consider the Bioloid a standard biped humanoid platform and my CH3-R to be my ultimate crowning jewel in my robot collection.
Whew! 
Hi, Just to droping in my word.
It depends what you want, bioloid, the brackets are strong enough to hold evrything you would want. With the lynxmotion brackets you will have to pay for stronger servos (5990s) so the biped will be more expensive…
Oh, how is the Bioloid in terms of “learning roboitcs” if its good ill probably get one. And do you have any project plans for the Bioloid (ssc-32 emulation, new servos, etc.) ?
Bioloid is an excellent platform to learn from. You should do a search on youtube on a user named “Kymhorsell”
This gentleman is one of the many Bioloid users who have fiddled with this kit quite alot.
Regarding not being able to upgrade the servos, it’s not really much of a disadvantage. The AX-12+ are quite powerful and is quite advanced having its own Atmega8 MCU inside each one.
The torque and power of these servos are pretty awesome, I don’t think I’ll need to “upgrade” mine anytime soon for what I’m doing…
I think the future of servos are going to be networked, self-contained servos such as these, seems like Kondos have gone this direction as well, a serial-driven servo with temp, load and other sensors inside…
Well, now im convinced i think i need one of these, question is, should i start out with the begginer or comprehensive? (im still a pure noob at robotics, though im learning alot) Also i think it would be really awesome to see a bioloid controlled through an ssc-32, it would be a big achievment, but im not sure if theres a chance it could work.
Well, if you want to eventually build a humanoid, you should skip the beginner and go straight to the comprehensive. You do not need the expert kit for a humanoid (it is an overkill), since the expert kit was meant for classrooms.
You might like the beginner kit but the difference in price of the “upgrade” kit warrants a purchase of the comprehensive kit up front.
Too bad LM doesn’t distribute the Bioloid, however, another great IL company does. Trossen Robotics:
www.trossenrobotics.com
Note: Awesome owner. Alex is (one of) the owner I believe. Seems like every robot distributor in IL are great people to deal with, excellent customer service and support!
You can also get them from:
crustcraw1er.com
Note: Seems to be in the US (480 area code), never dealt with them
robosavvy.com
Note: I believe a UK distributor. Limor runs the site and he is also an awesome person to deal with. Very nice and great support.
tribotix.com
Note: An Aussie distributor I believe, never dealt with them so no experience with them. They do have an awesome forum
I believe crustcrawler has the lowest price on the comprehensive kit, but the difference of prices are minor compared to the price you’ll pay for shipping depending on where you are in the world.
I really like LM, Trossen, and Robosavvy, but I am not a fanboy. I believe any good business deserves my money (that I earned with blood and sweat ) and in order to keep the biped humanoid going, all distribution channels have to be in good health. However, I can only recommend these three since I only have experience with these three…
If money was no concern, I’d buy from every robot store out there! Sadly, I’m just another wage-earning American schmoe so money is a concern… 
Awesome im probably going to purchase the comprehensive after i get my macbook. The bioloid looks really cool and fun to use. Do you think your ever going to get around making the bioloid servos work with an ssc-32? That would be really awesome, and it would open up even more expansions.
I don’t think the servos can be interfaced to the ssc-32. The AX-12s uses serially-driven commands to drive the servos. There’s a microcontroller inside each one, the atmega8, which takes in commands from a single wire interface and you essentially send and receive packets of info to control its parameters, such as servo movement, temperature limit, load limits, and etc…
wow the ax-12’s sound like pretty advanced servos. Out of curiosity, can you make a double knee joint with the bioloid? 8)
Yup, you can make a double knee joint if you wish. You’d probably need to get two extra AX-12+s to accomplish this though…
awesome im really thinking of getting one of these… i only wish their was compatibility to a ssc32 or a bb2 w/basic atom (pro). What do you plan on doing with your bioloid in the near future?
Nothing fancy right now. The bioloid humanoid walks great on hard floor, but I’m working on slowing the walking gait down and maybe attaching bigger feet (possibly the one from my biped scout) so that’s able to walk on carpet… Because of the softness of the carpet I have at my home, the bot stumbles over.
The default program has obstacle avoidance, so I think that part is done. Probably add some more code to let it be autonomous and not just walk aimlessly (possibly reduce the launching of the walking gaits and take statistics of the surrounding via the IR sensor).
You’ll definitely love this kit, but since majority of the foundation is there, sophisticated programming is what’s sorely needed.
hey tom have you played around with sensitivity settings on the sensor yet? you can improve the range alot! it makes for a better experance with the autonomous walking with the humanoid. I am now in the process of tearing down to um customize a lil bit.
Hey trey! Glad you can join us here… What do you mean by sensitivity of the servos? What setting do I fiddle with? I’ve been looking at the servo setting lately, to see if I can fine tweak it and such. I think JonHyland mentioned something about a load value being defaulted to the value of 1023. He stated that value makes the servos heat up faster.
I saw that to but I am lil skittish about messing with the servo values yet,what I was referring to was the ax-s1 out of the box it has very shallow range ,it has to get to close to something to work properly but you can change the range on it and it works much better! I will post more tomorrow and ref the manual page
Ahh, that, I was thinking of changing it too. The default humanoid does have too near-sightedness to it. Sometimes, when it’s at an angle with something, it doesn’t detect…
So how are you enjoying your humanoid? Did you ever resolve your CM-5 issue?
One more thought about the humanoid, I think the feets are too small. I’m thinking about bolting on my biped feet I have left over from my biped scout (the parts got cannibalized for my CH3-R hexapod).
The bioloid humanoid walks great on hard floor, but on carpet, it topples over due to the carpet not being rigid enough to push on the feet to keep it parallel to the floor.
You should check out the motion files too and try to follow the starting page of each motion to the next, some extensive gaiting from the manufacturer! I think it’s a clue on how fine the resolution have to be between each “pose.”
I have a waist rotate servo on mine, but for some reason it wants to rotate the waist, even though the motions for it is set to “512” when I checked the motion file in robot terminal.
I’m going to take that servo off and check its servo center. Maybe the horn is off center and when commanded to “512” it wants to move back to this position…
Hey tom,
When i get my bioloid, my ultimate plans are probably to have a pico itx running all programs to make it autonomous, and at the same time have the option of controlling it via wifi (remote desktop session). Then ill probably add some “emotions” to it by adding the famous propellor + Uled. My ultimate goal is to make it a competitior in robogames or robo-1.
Ill probably use the kit for a very long long time because it seems like an excellent base for expansion/hacking.
Also, has anybody tried controlling other dyna’s with the CM-5? or possibly even hitec servos? And does the Cm-5 use its own type of sequencer?
So how does that sound? i know this is probably going to take a year or two to get all the programming/electronics down, but does this look like a good longterm project?
Lol i know this was kinda random but i felt i had to say what i want to do with it.
